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P-12C Pilot

The Flight Simulator experience and other tangential thoughts
FS 2004 Aircraft

We constantly see posts on various forums about how poorly we model aircraft, how we should have chosen this aircraft instead of the one we did, etc. We see this so much we've developed pretty thick skins, and frankly some of the criticism is well deserved.

When I joined the team the aircraft list for FS 2004 was already in-place and the team was well into production. So whether I want to or not, I can't take any blame or claim any victories for the choices which were made. I do however think that the historic aircraft which were chosen were all worthy choices. In retrospect, we should have had better representation of the world history of flight with less emphasis on US aircraft, but that's water under the bridge now. Maybe we will learn from that mistake going forward...

The actual process to determine what aircraft are included in any version of Flight Simulator is a prolonged battle as there are so many strong opinions on the team. Going forward we are becoming less focused on keeping what has been done due to personal attachment or the money and sweat invested and will be focusing on what experience a given aircraft will provide for the user and to some extent what new capabilities it brings to the simulator. This isn't a veiled clue about the aircraft included in FSX, just an insight into where we may go in the future.

With the FS9 historical aircraft we raised the bar significantly with the instrument panels, gauges, exterior models, VC's, aircraft systems, and flight models. We still have room to improve in all of these areas (and are improving for FSX), but I am very proud of the quality of those aircraft. My personal favorites to fly are the Vega and the Comet, and they were also two of the most problematic aircraft to find good source for.

Speaking of source material, we go to great lengths to find the best possible source to build our aircraft. We have had representatives of the team travel to the RAF Museum in Hendon, to the Canadian Aviation Museum in Ottawa, the Experimental Aircraft Association in Oshkosh, and to Kermit Weeks Fantasy of Flight in Florida. Each of these facilities allowed us to spend several days photographing their aircraft spending hundreds of combined hours sitting in the cockpits taking more than 1000 photos of each aircraft (covering pretty much every square inch inside and out). We have also been blessed to have met many individual aircraft owners that have been willing to let us photograph their aircraft and even take us flying to get the feel of the aircraft in flight. A DC-3 isn't cheap to operate so this isn't a small deal. Poor me for having to endure such punishment sitting in, touching, and dreaming about all of these aircraft.

Just as a quick side comment, one of the aircraft I spent an hour or so sitting in was a Messerschmitt bF 109 at the Canadian museum. The aircraft had been recovered from a Russian swamp/bog and was restored to excellent condition including all of the original bullet holes from when it was shot down. When the aircraft was pulled from the bog the pilot's remains were still in the aircraft, and the story is that the restoration team couldn't get the smell out of the leather and canvas belts and other cockpit stuff. And let me tell you did it ever stink in that cockpit. It was really quite an experience sitting in that thing with the canopy closed... Eventually you get used to the smell and it's tolerable. The 109 has one tight little cockpit and I have a hard time imagining actually being in combat in it with the poor visibility and all.

In addition to extremely detailed photography, we also gather audio source whenever we can by recording operating aircraft both inside and outside from multiple perspectives. I've read some forum posts where folks don't believe a DC-3 sounds like what we have in FS 2004, but having been in the cockpit both on the ground and in the air, I can tell you that on a good sound system, it sounds exactly like we have it. Same goes for the Ford Tri-motor, the Jenny, and many of the others as well.

The Flight Simulator aircraft team has really talented and enthusiastic people creating aircraft, unfortunately we always have too many aircraft to build and too little time to build them. As a result we have to apply a broad stroke across the board for mass appeal and not dive very deep into the details of any one aircraft. Of course that leaves a lot of room for super detailed aircraft to be created by any one of the fine third party developers creating aircraft for Flight Simulator.

Posted: Tuesday, February 28, 2006 10:31 PM by P-12C

Comments

Dennis_k said:

The discusion of what planes should be in the next out of the box version of FS will alway's be around. I really liked that in FS2004 there were old planes modeled. One by one they mark a turningpoint in the history of flight.

But, now a day's you have Airbus fans, Boeing fans, Cargo fans, glider fans, etc etc.

In my opinion, the default planes in any version of flightsim are a great way to discover what the game is about. The addition with freeware and payware planes only enhance the total experiance of FS2004.
At one point in time the most are going to step up to somthing more difficult to fly.

I had great fun flying the FS2004 lessons and with the flights that i created with the default aircraft. Then eventualy i stepped up to the PMDG 737 and LDS 767.
# March 1, 2006 7:31 AM

davidvoogd said:

I thought the aircraft selection for FS2004 was pretty good, I really enjoyed the classic aircraft and have flown many hours in them, in particular the DC-3 and the Cub. One of the first flights I did in FS2004, and one of my favourites still to today was taking the DC-3 from my home airport in Southern, Ontario, Canada up north across Northern Ontario and Quebec to Iqualuit, Nunavut in Canada's far north.

For FSX my wish list would be to include the present variety, plus at least one aircraft from the two new emerging aircraft categories - the Very Light Jets (perhaps an Eclipse 500, Citation Mustang or Adam 700?) - and one of the new Light Sport Aircraft (almost too many to choose from, but make it a taildragger!)

Oh btw, us Canucks usually refer to our capital as Ottawa ;)
# March 1, 2006 4:52 PM

P-12C said:

Sorry about that davidvoogd, that's what I get for posting when I'm tired... Nice collection of aircraft at the museum by the way! Although leaving the Beaufighter out in the weather to rot away is a real shame.
# March 2, 2006 2:19 AM

davidvoogd said:

Not a problem. I've only been able to visit the Ottawa - Canadian Aviation Museum once, and that was 13 years ago (wow I'm starting to get old lol). It is a shame that some aircraft are still sitting outside in the weather, though from what I've read a new building has been added allowing many to come in, including the North Star.

I hope you had a chance to see the nose of the Arrow, too bad the nose is all that remains.
# March 2, 2006 6:54 AM

OwenHewitt said:

Hi Paul,

I was quite impressed with all of the historic aircraft - all are modeled well, and have a bit broader use of texture sheets - pays off for sure!  My favorite has to be the Piper Cub.  Attention that you put toward those aircraft shows that you are making strides in upping the ante a bit.  I'm looking forward to the improvements across the board with the defaults in FSX.  :)

Best,

Owen
# March 3, 2006 9:08 PM

Rob A said:

Hi Paul,

For me, I liked the idea of the old classic aircraft but apart from a couple of them, namely the cub and the dc-3, I wouldn't miss them if they were removed from future versions. The novelty seemed to wear off quite rapidly, for me anyhow.

As mentioned, I think looking forward to advances in aviation in the near future, such as the very light class of jets and high performance pistons, would be a great theme for new versions.

I guess what I really want to say is that all these 'extra' innovations added to FS (in the form of missions or default aircraft etc..) are great for most people but the novelty does wear off leaving the core product. And its refreshing to see that the team is focused on improving the base package (at least from the early screen shots of FSX, it looks like it).

Personally, I've had just one complaint about the last two versions, and its the graphical stutters or the lack of fluidity (graphically). If I had one wish, it would be that FSX is a night and day difference in fluidity compared to FS9.

Anyhow, great blog you have here.
All the best with FSX.
# March 5, 2006 3:50 AM

P-12C said:

I have to admit, I'm a little surprised at the number of you that like the historic aircraft. I do agree that for daily flying, or for simulating real-world flying, the use of aircraft that you would see flying around are going to get the lion's share of use. Flying the Vega to practice instrument approaches would be a bit odd...

In general, the Century of Flight theme was the inspiration for the historic aircraft and are not the norm for the core product.
# March 5, 2006 2:02 PM

Alpha-Pete said:

I've never had much of a problem with the quality of the default aircraft in FS, they are of decent enough quality in most respects but I'm afraid that I'm going to have to disagree about the sounds. On the whole sounds seem to be largely a side note of FS, whether it be in the both the freeware and payware community or the default aircraft in fs. Because of this I took to creating my own sounds and made my name releasing first on freeware and now create for Alphasim and Cloud9.
    Although one of the best sound packs of FS2004 the DC3 sounds only seem to simulate the sound of up to 2/3's of the rev range and doesn't sound like a Dakota on full whack, nor do FS default sounds take into account that aircraft often sound different when going at higher speeds. Some of the sound packs are like shadows of the real aircraft like the boings. I know I sound like I'm being unreasonable but I know that you guys have the skill and resources to create awesome sounds.
   I suppose the biggest improvement I could hope for is the addition of different sounds for angle of the aircraft to the camera, and different sounds for high speed as opposed to low speed and stationary. I know this is too much to ask this late in the day but for me the sound of aircraft is the best thing about them, working next to the runway at Gatwick and working on restoring old military aircraft engines has given me a passion for it.
     Anyway enough negativity, it looks like you guys are doing a fantastic job on FSX and I look forward to seeing more of it, keep up the good work and this blog is a great idea.

Respectfully

Pete
# March 6, 2006 11:06 PM

P-12C said:

Alpha-Pete, You are absolutely right that the audio for most aircraft in FS2004 are not as high quality as we would have liked. That said we now have a full-time audio director that is working very hard along with a developer to change that. I think you will be pleased with the results.

As for the DC-3, I was referring more to the character of the sound than the more technical details you mention. When we record an aircraft, we make it very clear that the owner of the aircraft has the final say on how long the session will last and how high they are willing to take the RPM's. The owner of the DC-3 was understandably cautious and we didn't run the engines at full power. The last thing I want to do is contribute to an engine failure and the potential demise of the crew and/or the aircraft.
# March 7, 2006 1:34 PM

Alpha-Pete said:

That makes sense and I am very familiar with the problems of recording decent sounds and when limited with the technology available I also understand that compromises have to be made. You are absolutely right in saying the character of the sound pack for the DC3 is spot on.

I have spent many a day at RAF bases or at the end of runways at airshows recording countless take-offs, landings, start-ups etc etc.... of aircraft in order to get the correct sounds for aircraft and know the expense. Could you not record some of your sounds from aircraft in flight or on landing or take-off to get some form of full power sound, it isn't easy but it almost certainly paid of getting F-4 Phantom sounds for me.

Ah you don't want to hear tips from me lol, you guys are the masters. Anyway good news about the audio director I'll be looking forwards to this release alot now.
# March 7, 2006 6:55 PM

n4gix said:

While generally pleased with the panels in FS9, I was disappointed not to see properly backlighted VC gauges (where appropriate).

Please, make certain that FSX's default a/c panels at least have the provision to add proper VC gauge backlighting, if you don't want to take the thirty-odd minutes to create and test the lightmap yourselves... ;)

As a case in point, the freeware TBM700 released last year had no VC backlighting. At my request, the modeler sent me the relevant portion of the .gmax source code.  It took me less than an hour to add the necessary entries in the Material editor, and create/test the lightmapping. ;)  Hopefully, the TBM700 team will release the updated version soon.
# March 22, 2006 12:37 PM

tdavart said:

I thought you guys did a bang-up job on the historical aircraft in FS9. They were (are) right up there with payware. You guys certainly did your homework. The airliners, well, that's another story. :)

I was stunned to see the the aircraft and vc's in the FSX demo. They are even better, and I'm not sure I've seen anything quite like the CRJ cockpit (well, maybe the CS 757). But it doesn't seem to have a big hit on frame rates either. And judging from the preview shots, I can't wait to see the others as well.

Very interesting about the Bf-109, and a little creepy. That must be the E model that Marseille flew in the Battle of Britain? I don't know what you were doing, but I can only hope that you guys might include a warbird in FS. Keep up the great work.
# August 25, 2006 1:52 PM
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